Episodes

Scroll through our entire archive – or search for ‘Relatively’ on your preferred podcast app and start listening today.

59 | Tatty & India Macleod
Catherine Carr Catherine Carr

59 | Tatty & India Macleod

Tatty and India Macleod are two of four sisters. Standup comedian Tatty describes their happy childhood as like " little women with emotional volatility and periods." Their mother moved them to rural Brittany when Tatty was 4 and India was 12. Big disruption for big sister India, while Tatty couldn't really remember England at all. "It all began in France." 'Les Anglaises' as the Macleod sisters were known always felt a little bit separate from the secluded community around them and as such, their time in France was a bit intense. The experience has provided rich material for Tatty's career. The pair ended up living together during lockdown, after Tatty had a break-up but the experience brought made them very close. Tatty and India talk about that, about growing up in an all female household, craving English food and Family Hold Back.

Relatively is brought to you in partnership with leading family history website, Findmypast. With family records you won’t find anywhere else and easy-to-use tools to help your family tree bloom, Findmypast is the perfect place to explore your ancestors’ amazing stories. Start building your family tree for free at Findmypast today.

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58 | JJ Chalmers & Ruth Padmore
Catherine Carr Catherine Carr

58 | JJ Chalmers & Ruth Padmore

JJ Chalmers is a former Royal Marine who was profoundly wounded by and IED during a tour of Afghanistan in 2011. His older sister Ruth is a nurse and knew too much when he was flown back to start his gruelling recovery which would take years. Now registered disabled, JJ works as a TV presenter and has won medals in cycling and sprinting at the Invictus Games. It's a crazy whirlwind of an existence and one Ruth and JJ could not have dreamed of when JJ was in hospital being treated for his many, many injuries.

In this episode we talk about how their relationship was tested by the effects of that bomb - as well as what it's like when your brother is mates with Prince Harry, growing up as vicar's children and the need the siblings share for everything to be very, very organised.

Relatively is brought to you in partnership with leading family history website, Findmypast. With family records you won’t find anywhere else and easy-to-use tools to help your family tree bloom, Findmypast is the perfect place to explore your ancestors’ amazing stories. Start building your family tree for free at Findmypast today.

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57 | Benjamin Zephaniah
Catherine Carr Catherine Carr

57 | Benjamin Zephaniah

Benjamin Zephaniah describes himself as a "Poet, writer, lyricist, musician and naughty boy." He is the son of a Barbadian postman and a Jamaican nurse and was born in Handsworth the 'Jamaican capital of England'. Benjamin attended over 15 schools as a child, moving regularly with his mother to evade his father, who was abusive. Unusually, Benjamin grew up separately from his siblings, who stayed with their dad. This means that the brothers and sisters are not close, and have almost the opposite story to tell about their childhoods. In this episode we talk about that, about what brotherhood means, about being the 'cock of the school' and how community organising after the death of Benjamin's cousin did something to repair the sibling bonds.

** Keep listening to after the music for a poetry treat! **

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56 | Pastor Mick Fleming & Sarah Frankel
Catherine Carr Catherine Carr

56 | Pastor Mick Fleming & Sarah Frankel

Pastor Mick Fleming ("aka El Bish") runs the Church on the Street in Burnley, which does incredible work helping those living in poverty. But it's a far cry from where Mick began. In this episode, Mick and his sister Sarah (collectively known as 'Flembos') talk about their sibling journey from playing out happily on the backstreets, to sudden tragedy and trauma to a life marred by violence and crime, before finding faith and freedom together. It's a rollercoaster of a tale which has attracted interest from the Prince and Princess of Wales - who wrote a foreword to Mick's book 'Blown Away' - and now Netflix, who are reportedly talking about adapting his life story for the screen. The episode also talks about the power of a mother's love and the value of a good old practical joke.

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55 | Manni and Reuben Coe
Catherine Carr Catherine Carr

55 | Manni and Reuben Coe

Manni and Reuben (Booba) Coe are two of four brothers. Reuben is the baby of the family and was born with Downs Syndrome (or Up Syndrome as he would like to rebrand it.) The pair lived together for years and are exceptionally close. However, a spell apart during the pandemic was bad for Reuben as you will hear - and he doesn't speak very much at the moment. We talk about all that, about having a sibling with additional needs and about the book that Manni and Reuben have written together: brother. do. you. love. me.

Sibs UK is a charity which exists to support people who grow up with or have grown up with a disabled brother or sister. It is the only UK charity representing the needs of over half a million young siblings and over one and a half million adult siblings.

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54 | The Happy Pear, Stephen & David Flynn
Catherine Carr Catherine Carr

54 | The Happy Pear, Stephen & David Flynn

The Happy Pear brothers David and Stephen Flynn were joined at the hip until they were 18. Active happy lads, they grew up in Ireland in a culture they described as sporty and masculine - with lots of drinking. As identical twins they played plenty of tricks: sharing teenage jobs and one on occasion trying to nick the other’s girlfriend! Voyages of self discovery taken in their 20s led the boys to give up alcohol, meat and begin a movement back in Ireland together. We talk about that, about trying to attract attention as a twin, about identity and how a place can shape you and about having a soul-mate for life.

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53 | Caitlin & Caz Moran
Catherine Carr Catherine Carr

53 | Caitlin & Caz Moran

Writer, broadcaster and journalist Caitlin Moran is one of 8 siblings. Her sister Caz Moran is a comedy writer and together they wrote ‘Raised By Wolves’ about their unconventional childhood in Wolverhampton. In this episode they talk about that and about: feminism, wet towels, boobs, libraries, homeschooling, being cheerful and optimistic when you have no right to be and escaping your home town.

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52 | Tom Ward & Charlie Ward
Catherine Carr Catherine Carr

52 | Tom Ward & Charlie Ward

Award winning comedian Tom Ward and his sister Charlie (Char-Lart) share a lot of things: a belief that we should take climate change more seriously; an ability to hold a tune and the traumas that surviving a childhood in a fundamental church (and for a short but damaging time a cult) left behind. The bond created by that experience is a 'gift' of sorts. The pair are incredibly close and despite living 200 miles apart are in constant contact. We talk about that but also about Harold and Madge from 'Neighbours', teenage kicks and a brush with the law.

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51 | Dr Nighat Arif & Irfan Arif
Catherine Carr Catherine Carr

51 | Dr Nighat Arif & Irfan Arif

Dr Nighat Arif and her little brother Irfan Arif came to the UK from Pakistan as children. Now Nighat works as a GP and is the resident doctor on BBC and ITV. Irfan is a criminal barrister. They have 3 younger (equally successful) siblings, too. "We are basically the migrant dream!" In this episode Nighat and Irfan talk about resilience, setting a good example, creating a village, the value of education .. as well as terrible careers advice, Tintin and the Spice Girls.

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50 | 🏳️‍🌈 Our 50th episode celebrates 50 years of Pride in the UK! 🏳️‍🌈
Catherine Carr Catherine Carr

50 | 🏳️‍🌈 Our 50th episode celebrates 50 years of Pride in the UK! 🏳️‍🌈

To celebrate the 50th anniversary of Pride in the UK , we present a collection of stories moments and memories from guests on the podcast who talked about their identities with their siblings. Stories from Westminster, the North of England in the 80's, the Millennium Eve and school days under Section 28. Memories of brothers and sisters supporting each other and providing unconditional love, even when the world could be a bit tough. Contributions from: Gok and Kwoklyn Wan; Angela and Maria Eagle MPs; drag queen Divina De Campo and Carys Cliffe and interior designers and TV presenters Edward and Sophie Robinson.

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49 | Lewis Goodall & Megan Goodall
Catherine Carr Catherine Carr

49 | Lewis Goodall & Megan Goodall

Lewis and Megan grew up in Birmingham in a busy household, where both parents worked shifts and it is fair to say the “ chalk and cheese” duo took a while to form a close relationship. Lewis went to Oxford to university leaving Megan at home to support their mum though some mental health difficulties, which was “tough”. In this episode we talk about that and about ace grandads, being a podgy kid, your mates thinking your mum is fit, The Crystal Maze as well as taking advantage of your sibling and learning to depend on them, too.

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48 | Jen Baldwin & Findmypast
Catherine Carr Catherine Carr

48 | Jen Baldwin & Findmypast

Jen Baldwin was introduced to family history when was about 10 and has been obsessed ever since. Inspired by stories told to her by her Grandma, she now has a career in genealogy and loves spending her days "delving into the history of humanity one person at a time". In this episode she picks her three favourite stories from this series of Relatively - from Kit De Waal and Dean O' Loughlin , Sophie and Edward Robinson and Jean and Pat Owtram: stories of squished potatoes, chemists, Barons, dog licenses and Bronze Age urns.. and she tells Catherine a heartbreaking siblings story from the pews of a church in Northern England to the shores of California USA, via two World Wars.

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47 | Poorna Bell & Priya Joi
Catherine Carr Catherine Carr

47 | Poorna Bell & Priya Joi

Poorna and Priya or Poobles and Preebles were born in Kent but spent a chunk of their childhood apart, with Priya in India and Poorna in the UK. The pair are very close and work on being friends as well as sisters - providing support to each other through bereavement, motherhood and their careers. In this episode they talk about sibling separation, manky gym kit, last minute packing and daily voice note habits. Priya’s book on motherhood, race and identity is out in Spring 2023 and Poorna’s award winning book Stronger is out in paperback now.

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46 | Shakira Akabusi & Ashanti Akabusi
Catherine Carr Catherine Carr

46 | Shakira Akabusi & Ashanti Akabusi

Shakira and Ashanti Akabusi grew up in the UK and the US, supporting their dad - Kris Akabusi's - stellar athletics career. Encouraged by him and their "tenacious" German mum, they had a very outdoorsy childhood with limited junk food and telly... The weight of expectation which came with their famous name was tough for a time, but both sisters are now incredibly proud to be Akabusis and value the work ethic they inherited. Being keen to protect each other from the hard stuff meant that Shakira suffered alone with postnatal anxiety for a while, until she reached out to family. Shakira's new book The Strong Like Mum Method is out this week.

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45 | Leroy Logan MBE & Hyacinth Roberts
Catherine Carr Catherine Carr

45 | Leroy Logan MBE & Hyacinth Roberts

Leroy and Hyacinth grew up in North London in the 1960s and 1970s. They inherited their work ethic from their Windrush parents, who came to the UK from Spanish Town in Jamaica. Assaulted by police officers in 1982, Leroy's father struggled to accept his son's decision to join the force. Hyacinth says "I never thought of Leroy as an officer, I still don't. I just wanted him to be safe." Actor John Boyega plays Leroy in the Steve McQueen film 'Red White and Blue' about his ascent to Superintendent: despite the racism form inside the force and hostility from his own community. In this episode, Hyacinth - who works as a nurse - and Leroy, who still works as a campaigner- talk about public service, faith, race, a free range childhood, re-enacting TV stunts and enjoying a warm and safe childhood in Finsbury Park.

Leroy's book about life as a cop is called 'Closing Ranks'

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44 | Pat Owtram & Jean Owtram
Catherine Carr Catherine Carr

44 | Pat Owtram & Jean Owtram

Pat and Jean Owtram are believed to be the only living sisters who signed the official secrets act.. and as a result it was not until after WW2 that they were able to tell one another what they had been doing to help the Allies defeat the Germans. Independent, clever and adventurous, the sisters are now a remarkable 98 and 96. Born in the aftermath of WW1, the girls were (unusually) determined not to settle for conventional lives. We talk about code breaking, travel, letter writing and memories from a childhood in the 1920s. And the sisters reflect on being each other's 'most important person' for nearly 100 years. Their book is called Codebreaking Sisters: Our Secret War.

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43 | Beatrice & Rosemary Mac Cabe
Catherine Carr Catherine Carr

43 | Beatrice & Rosemary Mac Cabe

Sisters Beatrice and Rosemary Mac Cabe grew up in Ireland but now live near one another in the USA. They started their hilarious hit podcast Not Without My Sister in March 2020, locked down in a house in Indiana together (maybe with some wine). In this episode they talk about: the Catholic church; their irrepressible mum and strict dad; fun facts about pigs and sex; depression as one way of getting more than your fair share of parental attention and being miracle babies.

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42 | Dame Esther Rantzen & Scilla Taylor
Catherine Carr Catherine Carr

42 | Dame Esther Rantzen & Scilla Taylor

Dame Esther Rantzen and her little sister Scilla grew up in London and - briefly - New York, where Esther got a taste for life in the limelight. Since 1981, Scilla has lived in Australia, which leaves a "real gap" in Esther's life. Technology helps the pair stay in touch and they talk all the time, staying close to their nieces and nephews, too. Brought up by their anarchist mum and engineer dad to be ambitious, the sisters pursued very different paths, but have supported each other regardless. As kids Esther may have stood up for Scilla many times, but also used her as a bit of a willing 'canary down the mine' .. !

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41 | Kit De Waal & Dean O'Loughlin
Catherine Carr Catherine Carr

41 | Kit De Waal & Dean O'Loughlin

Author Kit De Waal and little brother Dean O'Loughlin are 2 of 5 siblings who grew up in Birmingham in the 60s and 70s. Their Irish mother and Kittitian father were ill-equipped to provide the care their charismatic and clever children needed, and life was 'predictably unpredictable'. Despite the hunger and the cold which characterised their childhood, the siblings nevertheless have happy memories too, and banded together like 'Vietnam vets', bonded by the unique experiences they shared. Now Kit and Dean work as screenwriters together, drawing on their incredible knowledge of classic film, inherited from their father, whose love of cinema was an escape from tougher realities. Kit's memoir 'Without Warning and Only Sometimes' is published this summer.

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40 | Louise Boyce & George MacCallum
Catherine Carr Catherine Carr

40 | Louise Boyce & George MacCallum

Middle child Louise - of Mamas Still Got It fame, grew up in London with baby brother George and older sister Bonnie. As kids, George was subjected to 'loving abuse' by the girls, but nonetheless as an adult is their biggest fan. As a boy he helped direct some of Louise's very early modelling attempts and as a teen he helped her when the demands of the fashion industry to be ever thinner left her unrecognisable to the family. In this episode Louise talks about making peace with her body, harmonising in the car and how George found her a husband by accident.

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